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Please read carefully -- Anonymous - (1831 Byte) 2005-2-28 周一, 上午2:16 (421 reads) |
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作者：Anonymous 在 罕见奇谈 发贴, 来自 http://www.hjclub.org
1. "If you don't want to traverse a basic fact, you'll have to recognize that human thought has a history before the birth of human language."在你说THEREFORE之前,你最好解释一下,在人类有语言之前就有思维或思想这个结论是怎么获得的.它不是一个不证自明的"BASIC FACT".
2. "Therefore, when studying the objective law of thought, should you start from the beginning of thought, or from our contemporary definition of thought?"从现代人的观点或历史角度去研究人类思维的起源,就只能从现在的时间点对思维做现代意义的定义,否则就没有研究的起点和意义. 当你说"STUDYING THE OBJECTIVE LAW OFTHOUGHT"的时候,你就已经是站在现代(或说人类有语言和思维能力之后)来往回看了.因为尽管研究的是"OBJECTIVE LAW",他也是人类的思维的结果,是SUBJECTIVE的产物,虽然它必须符合"OBJECTIBVE OBSERVATION",世间是没有客观的"OBJECTIVE LAW"这中东西存在的,它必然是主观的(SUBJECTIVE).
3. "You are right in insisting that I should define thought and language before giving analysis."这不是我对不对的事,而是你的论述应该具有的最基本的前提.否则谁知道你在说什么?更无法和你讨论有或没有.
4. "However, I'm not inclined to accept the modern definition of thought, which essentially equates thought with language."哈...不打自招了?
5. "My definition of thought is the ability and process of utilizing objective symbols, be it physical or non-physical, to coordinate collective (social) activities."不管你的定义是否恰当,至少你接受了讨论问题必须有前提的逻辑,有进步,那我就可以和你开始讨论了. 请问,你所说的OBJECTIVE SYMBOLS是什么东西? 既然这个东西可以 COORDINATE COLLECTIVE(SOCIAL) ACTIVITIES,它必然在有某种"COMMUNICATION PROTOCOLS BITWEEN INDIVIDUALS FROM THE SOCIETY". 它如果不是某种形式的语言(语音语言,符号语言,动作语言,手语...)又是什么呢? 你还是需要给个定义.
6. "It might have confused you when I quoted a chimp's example for solving problems. I said it's a "kind" of thought. In strict terms, this is not human thought."你没有CONFUSE ME,那不是件很容易的事情,我希望你没有CONFUSE你自己,因为你好象又绕回到你的起点了,如果你不采用现在科学关于思维的定义,而自立门户的话,你至少应该给你的THOUGHT下个明确点的定义.
7. "What I meant thought is definitely socical in nature, since I frequently pointed out the study of the product of thought - the civilizations, as the essential route for understanding thought."我看你自己确实已经被CONFUSE了. 你说的THOUGHT到底是什么?具有SOCIAL IN NATURE,但不是语言为基础的.那么你这个"THOUGHT"是以何种方式通过什么介质 SPREAD ACROSS整个SOCIETY而成为SOCIAL的呢?
8. "Therefore, I never meant to encompass the animal faculties of observing and responding in the category of thoguht, although human thought indeed has its root in such faculties."你不用界定你的THOUGHT,因为那对你更有利!扯不清楚才是扯淡的最高境界吗!
9. If you still think that the unraveling of the structure and function of language can be depended upon to completedly solve the riddle of thought, just tell me how you are going to understand the most irrational (appear to the modern era) thought manifested in religion by analysing religious language? My opinion is that without giving an account of the prevalent social-economic structure, you can understand nothing in history." 靠!这两句话是从哪摘来的?和我们的题目风马牛不相及呀. 宗教的问题,社会经济结构难道和语言没关系吗? 你问的是什么?
最后, "Quote: the root cause of crime are criminals. What an analysis!"你说这句话的目的就是为了显示你知道这个句子? 抄书呢?
作者：Anonymous 在 罕见奇谈 发贴, 来自 http://www.hjclub.org |
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